7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

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Oscar
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7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Oscar » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:14 pm

So a couple of years ago I worked up a load of a 160grn projectile with 59 grins of 2217. The load worked well but the Sierra pill are starting to become a little expensive to the point whereby it was on $10 per hundred between them and the more premium Woodleigh, so some load development was called for.

Just to complicate matters I have recently moved house, though eventually there will be a more permanent set up, my kit is in many boxes so not ideal. In any case starting at 56 gns got a rather slow 2550 fps, 57 gns raised it to 2570, 58 gns to 2630 and 59 gns got 2670. From 57 up they are compressed loads. Now this is where it gets interesting.

The previous load 59 grains with the Sierra got 2740 whereas the woodleight is 70 FPS slower. The rounds length is almost identical but the shape being different ( fb v bt). Now my first suspicion is the powder. The Sierra was done on the 25 year old powder beam scale where as the woodys were on a electric trickle.....so maybe my previous load was one up or this is one down......will check on that tonight some time.


However the end result is not necessarily bad based on the 2670 FPS average I got from my small sample. The extra 70fps means the 1500 ft/lb energy is at just under 400 yards whereas this load is at 355 so still we’ll outside my normal stalking range. As for the group, again only a very small sample but more than acceptable at 9mm x11mm.
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Blasernovice
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Blasernovice » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:46 pm

Nice group. In my 7x65R I'm using 2213sc and a 162a-max. With 57.5gr I'm getting 2750fps from a 24" barrel.

secondtry
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by secondtry » Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:37 pm

Not surprised at those velocities. When you worked up your original load I thought your rifle did well to get the speed it did with 2217.

I use 2213sc and my current 7x65R load is close enough to Blaser Novice's to be the same. 160NP 58g 2213sc 2800.

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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Oscar » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:36 pm

There is always the option of 2213sc because when I went to 2217 it was because I was told they were going to be making it anymore or something along those lines????

As always my biggest issue is the m03 itself with its mag for the 7x64, it’s 86 mm long from memory so there’s <2mm of play.

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Davo 7mm
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Davo 7mm » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:35 am

Oscar, that's a good group, does the 17 powder fill the case as much as 2213SC, I haven't bought any powder for a couple of years, but have only used 2213SC for the time I have been reloading the 7x 64, did try 2209 early on, but groups weren't as good, a lot of people recommend the Alliant powders for h 280 / 7x64 but have never tried them as they are not always available cheers David

Oscar
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Oscar » Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:54 am

The 17 fills it up to the point that only using a drop tube to reload it with that charge. After a bit of investigation the reason I believe for the reduced speed has to do with the increased bearing surface between the woody and the sierra

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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by 9.3x64 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:30 pm

I have had fantastic results with the 7x64 using 175 grain Woodleighs and Alliant RL19.
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Oscar » Fri May 11, 2018 8:00 pm

secondtry wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:37 pm
Not surprised at those velocities. When you worked up your original load I thought your rifle did well to get the speed it did with 2217.

I use 2213sc and my current 7x65R load is close enough to Blaser Novice's to be the same. 160NP 58g 2213sc 2800.
I actually did try that powder recently and with the 160 averaged 2770fos but groupings were terrible, 1.5 inch was best group.

secondtry
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by secondtry » Fri May 11, 2018 9:17 pm

Oscar wrote:
Fri May 11, 2018 8:00 pm
secondtry wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:37 pm
Not surprised at those velocities. When you worked up your original load I thought your rifle did well to get the speed it did with 2217.

I use 2213sc and my current 7x65R load is close enough to Blaser Novice's to be the same. 160NP 58g 2213sc 2800.
I actually did try that powder recently and with the 160 averaged 2770fos but groupings were terrible, 1.5 inch was best group.
Slap me if I'm asking the obvious, but did you do a proper work up with 2213sc ? My experience, which is not as great as some, has been that if a reasonable powder burn rate/projectile combination is chosen happiness can be found. I have found ADI to be more accurate than Alliant, but with either I can make my personal hunting standard of under 1" for three. Usually well under.
Oscar wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:36 pm
As always my biggest issue is the m03 itself with its mag for the 7x64, it’s 86 mm long from memory so there’s <2mm of play.
You will have a long jump with that mag as compared to a single shot, but Euro 7x64/7x65 chambers don'tseem to mind a long jump (as shown by your 2217 load) so that shouldn't be an issue.

What charge weights have you used with 2213sc ?

Oscar
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by Oscar » Sat May 12, 2018 1:32 am

secondtry wrote:
Fri May 11, 2018 9:17 pm
Oscar wrote:
Fri May 11, 2018 8:00 pm
secondtry wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:37 pm
Not surprised at those velocities. When you worked up your original load I thought your rifle did well to get the speed it did with 2217.

I use 2213sc and my current 7x65R load is close enough to Blaser Novice's to be the same. 160NP 58g 2213sc 2800.
I actually did try that powder recently and with the 160 averaged 2770fos but groupings were terrible, 1.5 inch was best group.
Slap me if I'm asking the obvious, but did you do a proper work up with 2213sc ? My experience, which is not as great as some, has been that if a reasonable powder burn rate/projectile combination is chosen happiness can be found. I have found ADI to be more accurate than Alliant, but with either I can make my personal hunting standard of under 1" for three. Usually well under.
Oscar wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:36 pm
As always my biggest issue is the m03 itself with its mag for the 7x64, it’s 86 mm long from memory so there’s <2mm of play.
You will have a long jump with that mag as compared to a single shot, but Euro 7x64/7x65 chambers don'tseem to mind a long jump (as shown by your 2217 load) so that shouldn't be an issue.

What charge weights have you used with 2213sc ?

I did a work up starting at 53 grains and went one grain at a time until 55, then did 55.5 then 56. In terms of accuracy 54 was about the best but 55 to 56 showed good gains in velocity but the groups started to expand out. 56 though not compressed is full with no “ rattle” of powder. Same cases, primers with all cases checked for length.

secondtry
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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by secondtry » Sun May 13, 2018 6:11 pm

It is a bit puzzling is't it ?

Occasionally, groups will close, start to open, and then close again.
IF YOU ARE CONFIDENT about reading pressure signs, such as case head expansion, I would consider going a little higher in .5gn steps and see if groups start to close again.

Another thought is that many have obtained best accuracy from the 7x64/65R with longer, heavier bullets. I prefer 160s, but the most accurate load in my 7x65 was the 160 NF, which is a very long 160 with a long bearing surface. .5" vs .8" with others.
9.3x64 is very happy with the 175 Woodie.

This may not be the case with you as the Sierras worked so well, but might be worth trying.

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Re: 7x64 , 2217 with 160gn revisited

Post by 9.3x64 » Sun May 13, 2018 9:16 pm

Yes, I have always had more success with heavy projectiles in the 7x64.
Even factory 173 Grain RWS soft points were 1/2 inch.
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