The .308 Winchester for Long Range

A place to discuss subjects related to those who prefer to take those longer shots. Sponsored by European Long Range Hunting and EuroOptic

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secondtry
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by secondtry » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:00 am

Hi Bob.

What is the twist in your Rem 700 Custom shop rifle ?

I apologise if I've missed this,but can't find it in the thread.



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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by stokesrj » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:15 am

It is 1:10
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by secondtry » Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:51 am

Thank you.

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by stokesrj » Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:28 pm

The more I study this subject, the more I become convinced that the antiquated .308 is probably the best long range cartridge available. It is a hack, modest in all ways. It is also superb at getting the job done out to 800 yards. Magnums are superior at 800 yards and beyond, the 6.5 Creedmoor and likes are superior for shooting steel or targets, but the .308 delivers, just enough more payload to make it superior for hunting. I'm thinking if I had to reduce my R8 caliber choices to just two, it would be the .308 and .223. Boring, I know, but for 95% of hunting those two are all you need. But then, I could never give up my 9.3X62. So let's just make it three for old times sake.
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by Af300e » Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:53 pm

stokesrj wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:28 pm
The more I study this subject, the more I become convinced that the antiquated .308 is probably the best long range cartridge available. It is a hack, modest in all ways. It is also superb at getting the job done out to 800 yards. Magnums are superior at 800 yards and beyond, the 6.5 Creedmoor and likes are superior for shooting steel or targets, but the .308 delivers, just enough more payload to make it superior for hunting. I'm thinking if I had to reduce my R8 caliber choices to just two, it would be the .308 and .223. Boring, I know, but for 95% of hunting those two are all you need. But then, I could never give up my 9.3X62. So let's just make it three for old times sake.
Or 243 and 308. Same bolt head and 55gr to 200gr projectile weight range across the two.

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by SPEEDY » Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:57 am

I love the 6.5's but the old 308win is just a plain Jane get it done round that does it all without fuss or fanfare.
I'm soft and I don't care. :dance:

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by secondtry » Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:37 pm

Lost my post - again :evil: IT dyslexia methinks :lol:
stokesrj wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:28 pm
The more I study this subject, the more I become convinced that the antiquated .308 is probably the best long range cartridge available. It is a hack, modest in all ways. It is also superb at getting the job done out to 800 yards. Magnums are superior at 800 yards and beyond, the 6.5 Creedmoor and likes are superior for shooting steel or targets, but the .308 delivers, just enough more payload to make it superior for hunting. I'm thinking if I had to reduce my R8 caliber choices to just two, it would be the .308 and .223. Boring, I know, but for 95% of hunting those two are all you need. But then, I could never give up my 9.3X62. So let's just make it three for old times sake.
A lot of enthusiasm on display there Bob. :)

"308 is probably the best long range cartridge available" is a rather sweeping statement, particularly from someone as thorough as yourself :lol:

I think I get what you mean, and I definitely agree with your description of 308 vs 6.5C for hunting. However I'm pretty sure neither of us would want to tag a bull Elk or a Sambar stag at 800yds with a 168TMK (or any other projectile) from a 308. :D

I have come to the 308 only in the last ten years or so, having previously been firmly in the 06 camp and regarding 308 as a step down in power with no benefit. Eventually it dawned on me that 308 is a nicer case design - "semi-improved" perhaps. It also dawned on me than the shorter action (.84" for R700s) effectively brought the weight of whatever barrel is used, and of the front action ring, sufficiently closer to the shoulder to make the rifle handle and point noticeably better than an equivalent long action. Also more compact overall and a whisker lighter, both helped by the fact that I prefer a 24" bbl in 06, but am quite happy with 22" in 308.

So although I like and still use the 06, I am a convert to the 308 (no immersion necessary :lol: )

As testament to my conversion I am assembling a 308 with the goal of serious (by my standards) LR accuracy. I am trying for a carry rifle that will be effective at LR, as distinct from a LR rifle that can be carried (if the carrier is strong enough :lol: ) Most of the latter seem to top 11lbs, which is not going to work for me, despite the recoil reducing effect of the extra weight.

Barrel is planned to finish at 22" with muzzle being approx .665". I regard this as a medium to heavy sporter. Estimated scoped weight with an 18oz scope and Talley LWs is 8 to 8.25lbs. I am optimistic that there will be sufficient weight forward for it to sit steady on a rest or bags, whilst still being compact and quick handling. I have considered a slightly heavier barrel but am concerned that the whole thing will then exceed 8.5 lbs and that handling will become ponderous.

And completely unrelated to LR, but the 308 in a Stutzen as a very sweet combination :D

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by SPEEDY » Sat Sep 01, 2018 10:54 pm

That's the funny thing with LR hunting rifles and something that took a while to sink in.
When shooting long strings like I used to for goa5s where it was common to put 30+ rounds through in under 10 min a heavy barrel is needed.
But if your only shooting at a single animinal then a heavy barrel is more a hindrance then a help.
If you can shoot a 3 shot group in under a minute that's around 1/2"-3/4" then you have a barrel thats good for LR hunting out to 800m or even 1000m on a big game animal no matter how thin the barrel is.
My standard 308 barrel fits that bill, the trigger is definitely light and crisp enough, bipod fitted so all it needs is a good LR scope and it could do the job just fine and be only 7.5lbs rather then my old LR guns that all topped 10lbs or usually closer to 12lbs.
I'm soft and I don't care. :dance:

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by stokesrj » Sun Sep 02, 2018 5:29 am

secondtry wrote:
Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:37 pm

A lot of enthusiasm on display there Bob. :)

I think I get what you mean, and I definitely agree with your description of 308 vs 6.5C for hunting. However I'm pretty sure neither of us would want to tag a bull Elk or a Sambar stag at 800yds with a 168TMK (or any other projectile) from a 308. :D
Yes, perhaps too much enthusiasm. To be honest the thought of anything bigger than mule deer just didn’t enter my thoughts on long range use of the 308. That is because I love hunting elk with my bow and have personally shot only one with a rifle and that was at 150 yards or so. Where I hunt elk, in the Coconino National Forest, part of the largest Ponderosa Pine forest in the world, and how I hunt them, by calling, it is all a shortrange proposition. I would have to purposely look for a long range opportunity passing many short range opportunities to get to it.

So my statement was meant, and should have said for 300 lb class animals and under.
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by SPEEDY » Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:21 am

Apparently 875 yards is still an achievable shot on elk with the 308win. :lol:

https://youtu.be/RrQqPdRgw_w
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by secondtry » Sun Sep 02, 2018 6:30 pm

No explanation needed Bob :D Just a bit of Aussie leg pulling on my part. :D Enthusiasm is good !!!!

Anyhow we are both wrong according to Speedy's vid. :lol: Elk at 875 with the 308 are a doddle, although that was a cow.

I didn't like the fact that the targeted elk had a tree branch across the front end. I also noticed that the Berger appeared to zip straight through so I'm guessing it hit the spine. Good outcome, but perhaps some good fortune as well.

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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by SPEEDY » Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:24 pm

Not many put their failures up online either. :lol:
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by stokesrj » Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:27 pm

If you watch carefully you are correct it zipped right through the neck. So actually the shot was a poorly placed but lucky shot.
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by SPEEDY » Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:34 pm

I shot a lot of goats at 800m and none hit with a chest shot ever went belly up without going at least a 10m 1st.
Even the 338lap did about the same job, although it still did the job a lot farther out just the same.
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Re: The .308 Winchester for Long Range

Post by secondtry » Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:04 am

SPEEDY wrote:
Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:34 pm
I shot a lot of goats at 800m and none hit with a chest shot ever went belly up without going at least a 10m 1st.
Even the 338lap did about the same job, although it still did the job a lot farther out just the same.
Perhaps softer, more splattery bullets would have helped. Some of those goats are pretty small.

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